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Title: Provincial Merger?


Jacques de Beaufort - February 25, 2006 01:34 AM (GMT)
Due to the lack of citizens in the province of Asunción, I have come up with a proposition: The merger of the Province of Asunciňn with Puerto Nuevo.
Normally for the same reason I would have said to merge Asunción and Rio Grande cause they both have like two citizens each, but they are far apart geographically speaking, so I believe that an Asuncion-Puerto Nuevo merger is in order.
This proposition is to bring more debate into the provinces. We have too many provinces. and though each and every one of them has a special identity, it is needed for the purposes of activity that we do something about them.
With our current situation only general national debate and activity goes on, if say Asuncion and Puerto Nuevo were merged then we would have more citizens per province, thus more competition to get into the imperial parliament, and more provincial debate. Plus a provincial government in a province of two isn't much, but a provincial government in a province of say around 7/8 is a better thing that will spur activity within these provinces.

Again this proposition is to encourage debate and healthy political competition!!!

I believe that this could be a great thing since both Asuncion and Puerto Nuevo are located in the same island in Micras, and the are both in the spanish sector. The resultant province could be named Puerto of Asunción, the archduchy/principality (whichever you prefer) of Puerto Nuevo and Asuncion.

Also I propose this before the new update in Micras is made so that we can change our update claim.

What do you think? Is it too crazy? Or are you in on this with me cause you believe as I do that provincial debate is needed for a healthy nation?

Sincerely,

AugustoBenavides - February 25, 2006 02:02 AM (GMT)
Even tough I will be more likely to loose control over the place, and perhaps even my peerage, I do support this crazy idea by His Eminence, I understand completely His Eminence's point of view, I think we can be stroger spanish sector by merging, even counting Rio Grande on the same Archduchy or Principality.

Good idea my friend,

Cardinal Morales - February 25, 2006 03:32 PM (GMT)
I also support this idea. Especially from the point of view of the Church.

Jacques de Beaufort - February 25, 2006 10:16 PM (GMT)
I'm glad to see that the people from the spanish sector support this idea.

Sincerely,

Emperor Edgard II - February 27, 2006 02:52 PM (GMT)
I am not sure. I would like to keep Benavides and my brother with their titles. Well, it can happen... we'd have to strike a compromise in this.

Cardinal Morales - February 27, 2006 03:07 PM (GMT)
You could raise the status of the Benavides family Your Majesty, thus enabling the Archduke to keep his titles with one or two moderations and merging the provinces. Ascuncion would still exist as a place wouldn't it? It just wouldn't be the name of a Duchy. My suggestion would be to make Ascuncion an Archduchy but not a province, thus making the Archduke and Archduke officially, making the Benavides family a Princely House and that would give him the title of Prince of Benavides.

His full title would then be, His Highness, Archduke Augusto of Ascuncion, Prince of Benavides.

This was often the system adopted when German provinces merged and were changed. This wouldn't make the Archduke reigning Royalty or a member of the House of Portela, but would raise his family status.

Emperor Edgard II - February 27, 2006 03:13 PM (GMT)
Well, Prince Enrique is Grand Duke of Puerto Nuevo... what should happen to him?

Cardinal Morales - February 27, 2006 03:14 PM (GMT)
Well again, the place would remain so that wouldn't be a problem. I would suggest making the new province a Dukedom and encorporating it into the Princes Titulary. I am Bishop of Puerto Nuevo and in the same way, would keep that title because the place exists but the province as a whole is under a new name.

Emperor Edgard II - February 27, 2006 03:17 PM (GMT)
Ah, that doesn't sound too bad. The Benavides family gets a nice boost and my brother retains his title. Let me see what everyone else thinks.

AugustoBenavides - February 27, 2006 03:49 PM (GMT)
It works for me, I am surpsised that this can be done, now we just need Enrique's opinion I guess.

One more thing father, can you help me with my title?

I am currently Archduke of Asunción, Viceroy of Santa Gertrudis, Count of Revilla & Zapata, and on the name issue I have a question:

Is it OK to sign as Augusto de Corcovado? (the capital of Santa Gertrudis)

Or should it automatically be Augusto de Asunción?

Thanks,

Cardinal Morales - February 27, 2006 03:52 PM (GMT)
It should be Augusto de Asunción Your Excellency but if you were to be raised as a Prince then you'd sign Augusto de Benavides, (Augusto of the House of Benavides) or you could get permission to use Asunción as a joint surname, making you Augusto de Asunción y Benavides (Augusto of Asunción and Benavides).

Emperor Edgard II - February 27, 2006 03:55 PM (GMT)
The latter would be wicked awesome. :) But that's just my personal opinion... ;) :P ^_^

AugustoBenavides - February 27, 2006 04:15 PM (GMT)
I agree with His Majesty, thanks father your share of knowledge is greatly appreciated.

You could be a good advisor to us, I mean it in the most serious way.

What do you think Your Majesty?

Emperor Edgard II - February 27, 2006 05:10 PM (GMT)
Well, I am in need of a Lord Chamberlain...

Cardinal Morales - February 27, 2006 06:02 PM (GMT)
My thanks for your kind words Your Excellency. Your Majesty, I would consider it an honour to serve you in any capacity.

AugustoBenavides - February 27, 2006 07:05 PM (GMT)
This is good, you just joined Alexandria not so long ago and you got a very, very interesting offer on the table.

Needless to say, your services to His Eminence and the Church are invaluable.

Matthieu Poiters - March 2, 2006 02:22 PM (GMT)
i am opposed to this idea. it is not necessary at all for PN and Asuncion to merge.

PM.Poiters. Serving Alexandria for another term!

AugustoBenavides - March 2, 2006 02:46 PM (GMT)
Milord, it is not necessary, but it will be quite helpful for the joint development of the spanish sector.

I hate to disagreee with you, but my opinion stands.

Cardinal Morales - March 2, 2006 02:49 PM (GMT)
I would like to raise my support for the idea, because it joins the Spanish Sector and indeed, brings the Catholics there closer together.

Jacques de Beaufort - March 2, 2006 05:38 PM (GMT)
I am all for this proposition since it was I that suggested it. Now my new suggestion is that we write a law that we will present to the Imperial Parliament, to proceed with this. It should include:

QUOTE
New Name: Province of Asunción and Puerto Nuevo? Or anything you like.

Provincial Governments: Both Provinvcial Governemnts will be dissolved and a new one will be created to suit the new province.

Titles and Peerages: they should be in spanish since it is the spanish sector, therefore:
Su Alteza, Principe Augusto Benavides, Archiduque de Asunción, Virrey de Santa Gertrudis, Conde de Revilla-Zapata.
His Highness, Prince Augusto Benavides, Archduke of Asunción, Viceroy of Santa Gertrudis, Count of Revilla-Zapata.

Su Alteza Imperial, Príncipe Enrique Portela, Delfín del Imperio, Archiduque de Puerto Nuevo, Conde de Artoix.
His Imperial Highness, Prince Enrique Portela, Dauphin of the Empire, Archduke of Puerto Nuevo, Count of Artoix.

Provincial Representation: they would be represented by one MP in Parliament.


What do you think? We need to put this into proper writing and present it to the Imperial Parliament for ddebate and vote.

Sincerely,

HIH Prince Enrique Portela - March 2, 2006 06:13 PM (GMT)
Im not so sure, Prime Minister, i must say that im in agreement with you. I havent expressed much over the weeks about this. I am not in favor of this, it isnt necessary for both Provinces to merge. Puerto Nuevo is not predominantly Catholic and neither do i want the confusion to go around... That is why Asuncion was created and thats where the most of the Catholics are.

Agree to Disagree, fellers.

respectfully,

Cardinal Morales - March 2, 2006 06:20 PM (GMT)
By joining the two provinces Your Imperial Highness, it would link the province of Asunción with the Cathedral in Puerto Nuevo, as well as linking the Spanish sector.

AugustoBenavides - March 2, 2006 06:34 PM (GMT)
The church will have it's benefits, but that is a separate issue, on the separation of the provinces because the congregation of catholics, I believe that it should not interfere with this case.

Yes, we alll respect the church and all religions, but this is not a matter of the religion is a matter of development mutual benefits for us.

Emperor Edgard II - March 2, 2006 06:43 PM (GMT)
I am completely for this measure. I think it would make parliamentary races more competitive rather than the bore they have become recently.

I don't want this to be made into a religious thing. But, I think it will be cost-effective in that Parliament will be stream-lined and smaller, making things more efficient.

Also, this makes a nicer, bigger province to compete with Valenciennes. I'd like to see some competition or something like that to spark activity and debate. :D

However, I'd like to see the name changed to:
New Name: Province of San Martin.

It's obvious that if the island was former San Martin, when together it retains the name... and it's not a bad name either, you know.

Jacques de Beaufort - March 2, 2006 06:53 PM (GMT)
QUOTE
I am completely for this measure. I think it would make parliamentary races more competitive rather than the bore they have become recently.

I don't want this to be made into a religious thing. But, I think it will be cost-effective in that Parliament will be stream-lined and smaller, making things more efficient.

Also, this makes a nicer, bigger province to compete with Valenciennes. I'd like to see some competition or something like that to spark activity and debate.

However, I'd like to see the name changed to:
New Name: Province of San Martin.

It's obvious that if the island was former San Martin, when together it retains the name... and it's not a bad name either, you know.


Your Majesty, you have expressed my thought precisely. And I like the name. San Martin...sound really good.

Sincerely,

Emperor Edgard II - March 2, 2006 07:07 PM (GMT)
I'm already cooking up so many good ideas for the form of the provincial government... lol WOW, and I don't even live there! I'll just pass them on to someone else.

Jacques de Beaufort - March 2, 2006 07:32 PM (GMT)
Great!!!

Do you think it should be on the act we pss on to parliament?

Sincerely,

AugustoBenavides - March 2, 2006 08:31 PM (GMT)
I am all the way for it, on the name...well, I do like it, a lot, actually but then it come sthe bittersweet feeling for good ol' San Martin.

Emperor Edgard II - March 3, 2006 05:16 PM (GMT)
True... but we must honor and respect the island's history as well, even if it's a bit tumultuous.

Pete James - March 3, 2006 05:27 PM (GMT)
While one would think this proposed merger would be good for the PDP as it would reduce the number of seats not held by the PDP, I am afraid it will be bad for politics as a whole in Alexandria. The merging of the provinces will lead to an even number of constituancies, which could lead to stand offs in the Imperial Parliament

Faithfully,

Pete James
PDP Leader

HIH Prince Enrique Portela - March 3, 2006 05:50 PM (GMT)
Parliament should not have to decide on this issue its up to the provinces. I am still opposed to this.

respectfully,

Jacques de Beaufort - March 4, 2006 04:42 AM (GMT)
An answer to several concerns.

1. Mr James, there would be no even number, remember the Prime Minister also participates in Parliament.

2. Your Highness, your view is actually right the legislation merging the two provinces should be presented before the governments of the two provinces, and when approved it should be submitted to the Imperial Parliament. This is to do things according to the Imperial Constitution.

Sincerely,

hard_right - March 4, 2006 09:38 PM (GMT)
The Parliament is composed by four elected provincial reps, the Prime Minister and the Emperor's apointee. So it won't be in a tie.

Another thing is that we have to consider that micronations go a bit incative during the summer and a smaller Parliament that could fight against that, I support this and I agree about a smaller, streamlined Parliament. Remember that there are specks on inactivity in an mn and a smaller Parliament would ease up on the summer and other inactive periods..

HIH Prince Enrique Portela - March 7, 2006 08:16 PM (GMT)
We should put this up for a vote. I feel the citizens of Puerto Nuevo need to be aware of this. I for one stand with the Prime Minister on this one. I am against it.

respectfully,

AugustoBenavides - March 7, 2006 10:05 PM (GMT)
Then take it to the Provinces for a vote, in Asunción it might not be needed as we are the only two active citizens there (Beaufort and myself), and we both agree on this.


Jacques de Beaufort - March 7, 2006 11:29 PM (GMT)
Before a vote is conducted I feel that the bill must be drafted in its entirety, and then presented to the governments of both provinces if the governments agree, then the bill can be put forward to the Imperial Parliament where it will be voted on.

QUOTE
So the steps should be (in my opinion):
1. The complete drafting of the bill (I can do this tonight)
2. The debate of the bill by both governments.
3. If passed: the voting (no debate) in the Imperial Parliament.
4. If passed: provinces merge.

3. If not passed: the governments can introduce their ammendments or simply dismiss the bill.
4. If not passed: the bill goes back to the provincial governments who will try to comply with any proposed ammendment made by the Imperial Parliament, or simply dismiss the bill.


Sincerely,

Jacques de Beaufort - March 15, 2006 07:45 PM (GMT)
QUOTE
Treaty of Ávila

Between the Archduchy of Asunción, and the Grand Duchy of Puerto Nuevo to merge the provinces under only one provincial department. The Governments of the provinces agree that to further the development of the provincial political arena it would be best if both provinces merge. And to fulfill this goal they agree to the articles below and sign:

Article 1 - New Name.
The Archduchy of Asunción and the Grand Duchy of Puerto Nuevo will merge under the name of Principality of San Martin.

Article 2 - Provincial Government and Laws
The governments of the provinces will be dissolved to create a new government for the whole province. A General Assembly will be created to discuss the creation of such government. All previous laws that the provinces had passed are abolished, and new laws will be written by the government to be set up by the General Assembly.

Article 3 - Geographic Components.
The geographic coponents of both provinces will remain the same, but under the new province of San Martin.

Article 4 - Titles.
The title of Grand Duke of Puerto Nuevo will be relinquished by the Dauphin in favour of a person he will appoint, and he will take upon the title of Prince of San Martin instead. The titles will be as follows:
- Su Alteza Imperial, Príncipe Enrique Portela, Delfín del Imperio, Príncipe de San Martin, Conde de Artoix. (His Imperial Highness, Prince Enrique Portela, Dauphin of the Empire, Prince of San Martin, Count of Artoix.)
- Su Alteza, Principe Augusto Benavides, Archiduque de Asunción, Virrey de Santa Gertrudis, Conde de Revilla-Zapata. (His Highness, Prince Augusto Benavides, Archduke of Asunción, Viceroy of Santa Gertrudis, Count of Revilla-Zapata.)

Article 5 - National Representation.
The new Principality of San Martin will be represented in the Imperial Parliament by only one minister. However, the already elected ministers of Asunción and Puerto Nuevo will be able to serve until the remainder of their term.


Signed for the Province of Asunción:


Signed for the Province of Puerto Nuevo:



I am sorry it took me so long but finally I got down to writing it, and this is what I came up with all that is not specified in this treaty is let for the new provincial government to decide.

I hope you like this treaty and we can present it to the provincial government if passed by them, it should be signed by the highest nobles of each province.

Sincerely,

Matthieu Poiters - March 16, 2006 12:04 PM (GMT)


are you serious? i think that Augusto Benavides should be Duke of Asuncion, and Enrique be made Prince of San Martin. i think he'll agree to that. there needs to be an agreement anyways.

PM.Poiters. Serving Alexandria.

AugustoBenavides - March 16, 2006 03:31 PM (GMT)
Mr. Poiters,

Under this treaty, Enrique WILL BE Prince of San Martin, and myself will remain as Archduke of Asunción, I will not steep down to a Duchy once an Archduke my friend.

One more thing, I believe that as of today, Enrique is not a Grand Duke, but an Archduke, therefore, the treaty shall be modified according to this, so that the Archduchies of Asunción and Puerto Nuevo will merge into the Principality of San Martin.

Thanks,

Jacques de Beaufort - March 16, 2006 11:32 PM (GMT)
Augusto, according to the Imperial Statement regarding the components of Puerto Nuevo, the province is a grand duchy, therefore, Enrique is a Grand Duke.

If you think this treaty is fine then I can present it to both governments (asuncioner, and puerto nuevan) for confirmation, ratification, and signature.
From there to the Imperial Parliament that has to say either yay or nay regarding the merger.
And after that to the future together my friends.

Sincerely,




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